Used/Vintage Snowcat Pricing Theory

 

I have been trying to figure out used/vintage snowcat prices for some time now. I continue to be mystified. As I noodle I am typing out some thoughts. I'm looking for more input from more experienced snowcatters. These ramblings are not polished! It seems like location plays a really big role in price. Maybe because of the pain and expense of moving snowcats. Could be demand too--where demand is highest the prices are highest. Seems like western US and Canada have the highest prices. I just got back from two and a half months in Utah. Prices there are, to me, shockingly high. But I guess that is an area that uses snowcats a lot. And they seem to have a real nostalgia for Thiokols which used to be manufactured there. The local economy is also strong there. Prices in the eastern US and midwest (WI and MI) US seem the lowest. Probably not too much demand there. Not as much snow (almost three hundred inches in the Utah mountains already) either. And it seems like maybe some of the governments down here gave grants to buy new snowcats for the snowmobile clubs as some sort of tourism enhancement. Snowmobile touring to this or that area brings in lots of dollars. So those clubs have had used equipment for sale. Supply of used equip increases--and lower demand for used. The local economy is weaker there too. Snowcat buyers seem to be recreational and snowmobile clubs. Recreational users don't seem to like slower and heavier groomer type machines as much. Faster and lighter appeals to them for transporting people and supplies to cabins, etc. Better MPG too. Groomers (snowmobile clubs) want super reliability and more pulling strength. (I'm thinking of ski areas and power companies as industrial--not included.) Snowmobile clubs may have better budget too. I wonder if they mostly buy new now? Perceived investment value must also play a significant role. So future value, net present value of future value, cost of ownership, etc. are factors. (This is probably an entire additional study.) I have always feared trying to bring a machine over the Canadian border into the US. I think we are all afraid of the government down here. We have this thing called motor vehicle department which brings us up in fear of the bureaucracy. I've heard of people getting held up at the border. And fees... Paperwork delays. Being stuck. But some people have done it without much problem. You get it done with hired shipping but then it is fabulously expensive. So it is kind of an unknown. A little scary. Same with machines from overseas. Certain brands of snowcat seem to have greater demand too. I haven't so much figured this all out at all. Smaller sometimes seems more desirable and certain larger units seem more desirable. I think it has to do with maintenance experience and reliability. Also the types are trails in that area. Northeast US has tight trails. Western US has great big open spaces. Different machines work better in those conditions. Deeper snow out west too. Over the years I have bought a number of crawlers. So I have learned about undercarriages. I think not being able to physically inspect Internet equipment or be able to rely on the seller's inspection and evaluation can bring down price by increasing risk too. Risk with older machines seems to be a price factor. Prices and availability of labor and parts is something to be avoided as far as I can see. Spare parts for snowcats seem very expensive. I wonder if most owners are mechanics sometimes. (My first snowcat, a Tucker, needed ten thousand dollars worth of rollers/bearings--not counting labor. Kind of shocking.) Does any of this make sense? I studied economics. Pricing theory has always intrigued me. I don't know much about Canada. I wonder how currency differences play a role? Seems like the dollar gets weaker and weaker. Sometimes, maybe now, the Canadian dollar is stronger. So that has an effect. And then there is the human stuff. Having a machine for sale for a year can make people antsy. Equipment degrades when not being used. People know it. Risk of ignored maintenance is very scary too. Add that to great distance from intended area's usage and demand decreases. Everything always boils down to supply and demand. Quality of advertising seems to play a big role in selling price. The more people that know about the snowcat for sale leads to a higher price with more people bidding up the price (auction-wise anyway). Some people seem to know that they have something rare. And desirable. So they wait. And I guess get their price or hold onto their equipment and enjoy marveling over it. Being right too. Sticking to their guns. That seems to work sometimes. I think it depends on the demand for that brand snowcat. People can pay big bucks for older Thiokols 601 series. I guess they are fast, interesting design and heavy duty/reliable. There is real competition for these machines. Great demand and not so great supply equals higher prices. I hope to figure this all out someday. If you have an opinion of this I would love to hear it. So far I am envisioning a multivariable regression that solves for price. To summarize: the variables seem to be seller's area, buyer's area?, strength of local economy, brand snowcat, condition of snowcat, perceived condition of snowcat/risk (quality of seller?), availability of similar snowcats, type of snowcat (groomer, recreational/transportation or maybe industrial) (not really dealing with industrial snowcats here) therefore relative demand (more demand from snowmobile clubs or recreational users/collectors?), cost of spare parts, availability of skilled labor, quality of snowcat's advertising, transportation cost/shipping considerations and perceived investment value (future value). The regression is set to asking price. After the sale a similar regression can be set to selling price. The comparison of asking and selling prices over many sales can possibly show the relatve values of the variables. Anybody want to contribute any sales data or thoughts? Actually, anybody want to solve this? :-) Maybe just an intuitive sense is adequate? Maybe asking price is whimsical? Only reasonable prices really matter? Thank you!